Car (UK) September 1977 - 450SEL 6.9 vs Daimler Double-Six vs Silver Shadow II vs Cadillac Seville

[zej]

Worth a look for the cornering shots alone...

 

[Patrick_R]

Some very interesting reading here.
The Silver Shadow was always knocked for not being a good handler.
I laugh at things like this, it’s like saying a Kia Carnival handles poorly around a race track (I actually read that in a Carnival write up a few years ago) and its 0-100km time was sub standard
I actually wrote a letter to Wheels asking said journo to give the Carnival to his wife for a couple of weeks for the school and shopping runs etc, as this is what we want to see a Carnival reviews like.
These types of cars, and others of course are not meant for this type of operation.
I do have to say, yes, the Silver Shadow in its original suspension form, (which mine was) was a beautiful car to ride in, and could wallow if driven incorrectly. The biggest initial issue with the Silver Shadow when a new driver got in was its extremely light and powerful power steering.
It would always catch the un educated driver out, and drop the nose very dramatically deep in the direction the wheel was turned due to its extremely soft suspension & damper settings into oversteer, then of course a panic re correction would happen, the driver would pull hard on the steering again.
Any turns of the steering if driven lively to late into the corner would result in this, then of course as the tyres let go, horrible understeer was experienced.
The Shadow needed to be set up for a corner about 10-20m earlier than normal and use the set up to get her around a hard bend at speed. For a 2.2 tonne car, you could actually get her around faster bends pretty well.
Once understood, it worked very well, but images like the above are by someone driving the Shadow around a bend as they would the Mercedes Benz, which of course was a supreme handler, as it had this dialled into its chassis build.
I’ve driven a few of the W116 at speed, and they were all extremely good around corners at speed.
I found the XJ was good around bends and corners, but way too hard for normal around town driving.

 

[Michel]

I’ve driven a few of the W116 at speed, and they were all extremely good around corners at speed.

This W116 handled corners at high speed very well... on three wheels at Oran Park!

 

[BenzBoy]

Two observations:
1. The photos certainly show the difference between under and over steer.
2. A far more interesting and comprehensive report than the modern equivalent.
Regards,
Brian

 

[sean sherry]

In the UK a Suspension Kit was available for the Silver Shadows .. Springs and Shocks.... prevented cornering on the Door Handles !

 

[Oversize]

Even the tyres on the Benz seem to be relaxed compared to the other cars during cornering!

 

[zej]

Some very interesting reading here.
The Silver Shadow was always knocked for not being a good handler.
I laugh at things like this, it’s like saying a Kia Carnival handles poorly around a race track (I actually read that in a Carnival write up a few years ago) and its 0-100km time was sub standard
I actually wrote a letter to Wheels asking said journo to give the Carnival to his wife for a couple of weeks for the school and shopping runs etc, as this is what we want to see a Carnival reviews like.
These types of cars, and others of course are not meant for this type of operation.
I do have to say, yes, the Silver Shadow in its original suspension form, (which mine was) was a beautiful car to ride in, and could wallow if driven incorrectly. The biggest initial issue with the Silver Shadow when a new driver got in was its extremely light and powerful power steering.
It would always catch the un educated driver out, and drop the nose very dramatically deep in the direction the wheel was turned due to its extremely soft suspension & damper settings into oversteer, then of course a panic re correction would happen, the driver would pull hard on the steering again.
Any turns of the steering if driven lively to late into the corner would result in this, then of course as the tyres let go, horrible understeer was experienced.
The Shadow needed to be set up for a corner about 10-20m earlier than normal and use the set up to get her around a hard bend at speed. For a 2.2 tonne car, you could actually get her around faster bends pretty well.
Once understood, it worked very well, but images like the above are by someone driving the Shadow around a bend as they would the Mercedes Benz, which of course was a supreme handler, as it had this dialled into its chassis build.
I’ve driven a few of the W116 at speed, and they were all extremely good around corners at speed.
I found the XJ was good around bends and corners, but way too hard for normal around town driving.

I'd be interested to hear more about your Silver Shadow - early one or series II?

I've only driven an early 70's Shadow -hydropneumatics front and rear, pre-Harvey Bailey handling kit.
Compared to the Silver Cloud II and III's I've driven (as a hire car driver) it was a revelation! The ride, handling, braking (especially the braking!), the whole package.
That said as outdated as they were, the Clouds could really hustle if you drove them sympathetically. Exactly like you said with the Shadow, plan ahead for the corner, gently load the suspension first before giving it more steering lock and once settled (with decent tyres of course) it'll hold surprising speed on the freeway on-ramps and have drivers of newer, smaller and nimbler cars doing a double-take as a grand old 2 ton limo flies past on the outside lane. They don't respond well to the heavy-handed or careless, Melbourne taxi-driver type of driving. It was always the old 1958 Cloud II that I felt drove better than the newer 60's Cloud III's. The power steering was noticeably firmer than the later models and gave great feedback and confidence.

 

[Patrick_R]

Great insight.
The Silver Cloud III was a test bed for many Silver Shadow items, mechanical (V8) and exterior design right down to the twin headlights with common surround bezel with RR logo between and both designed by John Blatchley.
I’m pretty sure the Cloud III had the same super light American Saginaw power steering.
Mine was a 1972 MkI